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Friday, August 06, 2010

Mawage

Thanks to the ruling the other day, there are those who are afraid that the gays have stolen marriage. They've taken what has always been defined as "between a man and a woman" and twisted it to mean something different. I am here to calm your fears. The gays haven't stolen marriage; we gave it away.

No, that's not even accurate. It wasn't given away. It was tossed out, surrendered, discarded. It was abandoned by society in general and even by Christians in particular. I base this, first, on the ruling of the court. The judge outlined most of these changes. But it's not just his ruling. Consider the facts.

Marriage has been defined for all time in pretty simple terms. It is the union of a man and a woman for the purpose of forming the basic societal structure, the family, which includes at its core, children. Not complicated. Not intricate. Not hard to understand. And no longer applicable.

It used to be that when a man and a woman married, the union was marked by the taking of names. That is, in the words of the ruling, marriage "traditionally required that a woman’s legal and economic identity be subsumed by her husband’s." This wasn't a hardship; it was a given. It was, you see, a union. The income earned wasn't "my money", it was "our money". There was one bank account, one income, one economic unity. She was no longer "miss", but "missus" (Mrs.), and he was no longer "master", but "mister" (Mr.). It was a fundamental change to their identity that united them ... because it was a union. Of course, we've thrown that out these days. We threw it out when the households went from "stay-at-home moms" to "two-income family". We threw it out when separate bank accounts became not only normal, but preferable. We threw it out when we shifted away from taking the family name and going first to a hyphenated version followed today, in some realms, in a version where she doesn't take his name at all.

It used to be that sex was recognized as the physical union of man and woman. It was reserved for that process. The "honeymoon", everyone knew, would be the first time that sexual relations would be part of their relationship. Sex was, in the sense of "special and set apart", sacred. It was understood that, while there were those who ignored this sacred union, they were "bad", not "normative". But we threw that out when the "free love" society got its hooks into us. Sex became recreational, a thing done for fun. It was a gradual process. It went from "only in marriage" to "only in love" to "only if we want to". Today there is "friendship with benefits", where no one even hints at commitment, love, or any such thing. It's entertainment.

It used to be that wives were expected to submit to their husbands. This wasn't intended nor required to be demeaning or devaluing. (Think about it, folks. Jesus submitted to the Father. Did that require that He was of less value? Not at all!) "Fortunately", women's lib came along and put an end to that "monstrosity". Women were no longer to be subject to their husbands! And the world bought it. Even the Christians! Never mind that the Bible says it should be so. Feminism was much wiser than any silly Bible verse could be. And we threw away that union of relationship which made for a uniform hierarchy and created a new one that made two, individual leaders.

It used to be that marriage was expected to be "for life". You know, all that painfully silly stuff like "'til death do us part" and all. Honor, integrity, self-sacrifice, all that nonsense. But it made for a particularly strong cohesive unit when two people, faced with no other options, decided that they would learn to be honorable, have integrity, and actually sacrifice their own preferences for the benefit of the family (the children and each other) because that was what they had to do. The bonds of love that were forged through that furnace were typically much more enduring than the "love" we see today that changes on a whim. But we tossed that one out when we decided that it was much more "reasonable" to allow for "no fault" divorce. Now it's a divorce on a whim, and the backlash from that ongoing disaster has actually scared many young people away from marriage at all.

It used to be that children were a given. If you didn't have kids, it was a sad thing, not a matter of wise thinking and careful planning. Some may argue that this isn't true, but doesn't nature itself prove that it is? Even the most hard-core feminists seem to have unexplainable inner urges to have a child. Every woman knows the phrase, "My biological clock is ticking." No matter how much modern women wish to decry any need for children, it appears to be a fundamental part of their nature. Science has gone to great efforts to be able to produce children for infertile couples. And, of course, it was the very first command from God: "Go forth and multiply." So there is that. Historically, women without children were pitied, not applauded. But the judge has ruled "Never has the state inquired into procreative capacity or intent before issuing a marriage license." True. We threw out procreation as a fundamental component of marriage when we decided that it was probably a good idea not to have kids sometimes. We threw it away when we -- even Christians -- agreed that it was wise to incorporate contraception into our daily lives. (Are you aware of how recent that decision is? For instance, in France, birth control was banned until 1965. That's how new this idea is.) When we made children first optional and then a disadvantage, we threw out that aspect of marriage.

This didn't happen "just the other day", folks. And it wasn't "the gays" that did it. Marriage has long been defined as "the union of a man and a woman for the purpose of forming the basic societal structure, the family, which includes at its core, children". We dismantled that. We dismantled "children" as a core value when we embraced "family planning". We jettisoned "union" as a core component when we incorporated "gender equality", separate bank accounts, "equal rights", the "two-income family", "no fault" divorce, and sex for fun. So there we stood, all of our definitions dismantled, with only "between a man and a woman" remaining, and wondered how in the world "the gays" could steal marriage from us. They didn't. We -- the world, our society, even Christendom -- threw it out so long ago that many don't even have a clue what I'm talking about. "What? When did marriage mean that?" Marriage, to many today, is something of the humorous lines from The Princess Bride: "Mawage. Mawage is wot bwings us togeder tooday. Mawage, that bwessed awangement, that dweam wifin a dweam ... And wuv, twu wuv, will fowow you foweva ... So tweasure your wuv." Yeah ... that's not it.

I have seen the enemy ... and it was us.

16 comments:

Marshal Art said...

That's it in a nutshell, no doubt about it. But I think that the homo marriage issue is really bring home to many the point you are making. Indeed, the homo marriage proponents have a similar list, but they use it as a reason homo marriage should be given consideration.

Very good post.

Jeremy D. Troxler said...

Stan,

First of all I loved the Princess Bride and had a good time remembering all the great lines in that movie. I don't even know if I can pick a favorite. Probably right up at the top is "Never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line...hah hah hah hah, hah hah ..." A good reminder that even the most cunning can outthink himself.

I would like to encourage you, Stan. It seems by the tone of the article (unless it was meant tounge in cheek, which didn't come through) that we are acutally capable of throwing marriage away any more than others are capable of stealing it.

This is what we stand on, and what my article on marriage at my blog was all about. Marriage was established, defined, blessed by God. A man and a woman leave their parents and come together to become one flesh. Quite simply, there is nothing any individual or group of humans can do to change that. We can align ourselves with the truth, or pass our own laws as a farcical attempt to shake our fist in the face of God and claim victory is re-defining reality by perverting what He established. You and I both know that one day, in the twinkling of an eye, every knee shall bow, every tongue confess the Jesus is Lord. On that day, all the laws and disobedience of man will be laid bare as we all stand before a righteous judge.

Whatever laws they pass doesn't change marriage, that was established by God alone; defined by God alone, never to be changed by humans. You would be absolutely correct in saying we have failed in defending it. But be encouraged and rest assured, the definition of marriage remains unchanged. That knowledge, I would wager, even among the cheers of victory causes an unsettled feeling in many who would profane this that God has established.

Stan said...

Not tongue in cheek at all. We (society in general with major contributions and buy in from the Christians) have managed to dismiss genuine marriage ... and then wonder why it is that no one seems to know what marriage is anymore.

I am confident that "marriage" will remain "marriage" despite society's efforts to subvert it. It is no small issue. It does, however, make communication dreadfully difficult, as I tried to explain way back in 2008. If they're going to subvert the term, can they at least give me another one that expresses what I mean? Is it not a repression of my freedom of speech to steal my words and change their meanings and then tell me I have to use it their way? Yeah ... try that one in court. Never mind.

Jeremy D. Troxler said...

I am pretty sarcastic by nature (which I have to work on constantly because of the damage it can do to relationships i'd just as soon not destroy) so I usually just make a nonsensical claim and challenge them to tell me how i'm wrong. Something like, "Oh, marriage is whatever we define it to be, well i'm so relieved because to me marriage and divorce mean the same thing to me - open relationships with all people. I'm married to all my friends right now." If you can manage to say that with a straight face and remain serious to the point of demanding them to explain how you're wrong based on their logic it makes a pretty strong impact.

I've found the answers are one of two - either "You can't just go defining it any way you want" which bring it home pretty quickly. The other is "but the Supreme Court is the one who ultimately defines what marriage really is". That one is much more scary if they really believe it and takes a bit more time to work through.

Either way, it really doesn't do any good to try to make a logical argument in that discussion. I feel your frustration.

Stan said...

Sarcasm is just one of the services I provide. No, I feel your pain. It comes far too easily to me and it is something I try to avoid ... as much as it might appear otherwise.

"the Supreme Court is the one who ultimately defines what marriage really is"

What a terrifying concept! Unfortunately, in terms of legal actions, it is true. Well, at least the court defines it. So we're left with few options. I wonder what would happen if we just quit paying attention to the government when it comes to marriage? I mean, if Christians married under Christian terms and ignored the government's approval or lack thereof, where would we be?

What worries me is that we would conclude that the cost was too high. As if government approval is worth surrendering what is right.

Dan Trabue said...

I mean, if Christians married under Christian terms and ignored the government's approval or lack thereof, where would we be?

I'm sorry, Stan, delete if you wish, but I feel I must answer this question: IF you just ignore the process of getting state approval and marry only within your church, you will be right where our gay brothers and sisters are right now, with no legal rights and penalties against you, as opposed to the folk who DO have the legally sanctioned marriages.

In fact, that's what some of our folk have done - in solidarity with our gay brothers and sisters who are unable to get the protections of marriage, they've chosen not to get legally married, either. If I were getting married today, it's what I would do.

Perhaps that helps you see why this is an important legal and justice issue. Now, if we moved to making marriage solely a religious rite and did away with all gov't interventions for gay AND straight, that might be a fair and just solution, but giving benefits to some folk and not to others is an unjust situation that will change in these United States sometime in the coming years.

And, surprise, surprise, marriage won't be hurt at all by it. It will continue on just fine, thank you very much. Religious freedom will remain intact and you will not be forced to marry a guy or anything like that.

I'm not sure what you all think is going to happen that will somehow undermine marriage, if people are embracing the commitment and fidelity of marital bliss. I've never seen anyone credibly address that question. It's just this vague "Oh no, we'll be undone!! Horrible things will happen! I don't know what, exactly, but it will be horrible. Gang rapes or something like that, probably..."

Sorry, I could not help myself, going away again...

Oh, also, I DID want to let you know that since you don't really want to discuss these issues here, I may sometimes lift your words to illustrate a point at my own blog, which I've done on this topic.

I've left you nameless to protect your privacy and avoid gossiping about you. I'm only talking about the ideas expressed by folk like you.

You are, as always, welcome at my blog.

Stan said...

Dan, I put this one in because 1) it was friendly enough, 2) it deserves a response, and 3) I don't intend to beat the subject to death any longer than to respond to this. With that as a preface ...

Stan said...

... I noticed when I read the court documents this very odd notion that marriage is a right. I find it odd because 1) they are intentionally and knowingly redefining the term and 2) seem to make it out that marriage (however they define it) is a function of the government. Now, when I read in my Bible about marriage, I read things like "What God has joined together, let no man separate." So how, exactly, the government confers this extraordinary event (the event of making two one, of making two individuals into "a family") is honestly beyond my comprehension. In fact the notion is ludicrous to me. My understanding of the role of government in the concept of marriage is "We recognize it and protect it", not "we make it so". And I believe this is still the case.

Stan said...

As such, marriage -- true marriage -- is actually outside of the government purview. They can acknowledge it, but they can't confer it. They can say, "We recognize this as 'marriage' and confer on it certain rights and responsibilities", but they cannot say, "This is marriage." Or, to put it the other way, if a man and a woman went into a church (as an example) and pledged before God and Man (I believe a public pledge is required) "'til death do us part" (and all that that entails), they would be married. (I'm being simplistic. Just try to see the point.) No license. No government approval. No record at the courthouse. It is still married. They would not get the "marriage benefit" (yeah, right, like that exists) from the IRS or the rights and privileges other organizations and government entities confer on the government-approved married, but they would be married. So when the cry is "We demand equal rights to marriage", I'm at a loss. That function is not within the rights (or capability) of the government to confer. (Of course, conferring marriage on a same-sex couple is not with the rights or capability of anyone to confer, since it is a contradiction in terms. Such a relationship, whatever it is, is not "marriage". And simply demanding it or wanting it doesn't make it so. I may wish to be my cat's daddy, but it ain't gonna happen either.) (But, rest assured, we won't be debating this topic. Been there. Done that.)

On the notion of redefining marriage to give that right (by law) to people of the same gender, I love the way that the opponents of the longstanding, traditional definition of marriage love to state with absolute certainty and without the slightest equivocation, "marriage won't be hurt at all by it". Re-reading my post to which these comments are being made, it's like saying, "Marriage won't be hurt at all by no-fault divorce" or "Marriage won't be hurt at all by contraception" or "Marriage won't be hurt at all by embracing the morality of sex outside of marriage" or ... well, you get the point. So badly has marriage already been hurt that the court is willing and able to redefine it. Marriage isn't hurt? Marriage is already deathly ill, so horribly sick that it is disfigured and hardly recognizable and if someone suggests what it should be, they are ridiculed and rejected. What we have today is not what "marriage" is supposed to be. And moving it another radical step away is not improving it. Explaining to my kids or my children's kids what marriage is supposed to be? Nearly impossible. The result? Marriage is being rejected by more and more heterosexuals and embraced by "same-sex" couples while they continue to rend the term "monogamy" so that it means "one at a time ... mostly". Try, if you can, to embrace "same-sex marriage" while holding off polygamy or inter-species love, you rotten bigot. No, no, I'm not calling you a rotten bigot. But, just like my attempt to retain marriage for what it is supposed to be, I don't see how you could possibly deny my neighbor the right to marry his dog if he embraces the commitment and fidelity of marital bliss. (That was your phrase. I'm not even sure what you mean.)

Stan said...

Oh, and Dan, FYI, not naming names while calling them "Stupid, stupider, stupidest and stupidester" doesn't qualify as Christian charity. And why in the world "folks like me" would believe we would be "welcome" at your blog when you are so quick to ridicule beliefs with which you disagree? Again, avoiding names doesn't make that better.

(By the way, when I spoke of "a concerted effort to undermine marriage as a whole", it was not some silly "gay agenda". The "concerted effort" isn't coming from them, even if I believe they are part of it.)

Jim Jordan said...

Dan makes a good point here -- "but giving benefits to some folk and not to others is an unjust situation that will change in these United States sometime in the coming years."

Benefits, exactly, NOT rights. Marriage is a benefit to married folks (a man and a woman)who will potentially bring children into the world and raise them.

A man and a man cannot bring a child into the world even potentially. This benefit does not apply to them any more than a teenager can collect Social Security benefits.

Adding same-sex marriage to marriage benefits does not expand marriage, it destroys it.

Stan's recurring point is absolutely correct in that it was the heterosexual couples who attacked marriage first. It was only a matter of time before gays caught on to this and saw that selfish heterosexual relationships that devalued children were not unlike their own relationships.

Dan Trabue said...

not naming names while calling them "Stupid, stupider, stupidest and stupidester" doesn't qualify as Christian charity.

Just to clarify, I'm mocking the ideas, not the people. I think it is okay to mock silly ideas because, well, they are silly. And when silly, ridiculous ideas are promoted as serious thought, then it's okay to call attention to how silly those thoughts are, so that they might be exposed as ridiculous and then ignored.

Suggesting that we remove the liberties found in our Constitution just because other nations don't practice those same ideas, surely you could agree that this is a nutty idea, yes?

Suggesting that "the gays" (do you know how offensive that is to group and stereotype in that manner?) will "target your children" IS a silly idea, don't you agree? Do you really think that gay folk are planning this mass targeting of children? And to do what? Indoctrinate them? Make them gay?

These are goofy ideas, I have exposed the ideas as goofy. Folk are welcome to discuss those ideas at my blog, but if someone promotes a stupid idea, they will rightly understand that others will point that out, I'd hope.

As to marriage: Do you understand that there are two concepts going on here? There is marriage as considered by some religious folk, a rite within the church.

Then, there is also the marriage that is a legal contract at the state level, conferring special rights and privileges upon those thus married. THAT is what is at the heart of this.

If some churches want to call "marriage" ONLY that which has been sanctioned by a church (in good standing) only between Christians and even Only between Christians of the same race! - churches are free to do that. What they can't legally do in our nation is take deprive others of that same right at the state level.

I'd be open to the idea of removing marriage from the state's responsibilities altogether, BUT as long as we DO have it, then by our laws, it must not be used as a way of depriving justice from some and giving privileges to others. At the state level.

It is THAT version of marriage that needs to be just or go away. You are free to define marriage within your church however you want and what the state does won't effect you at all. Marriage will still be here after marriage becomes an equal opportunity benefit. I just don't see what in the world you think will happen to it.

Peace.

Unknown said...

Dan,
in many states (California included) a gay couple has all the same benefits as a married couple does already. At least those given by the government.
For some reason though, they still want it to be called marriage.

So apparently there's more to it than tax benefits and hospital visits.

For that reason, I get suspicious that possibly there's an agenda other than just "rights and benefits" at hand here.

Stan said...

Dan, again, for clarification, you commented and I allowed it because I thought it deserved a response, but I specifically said, "I don't intend to beat the subject to death any longer than to respond to this." Now you've responded, and I will do one more round and then we're done. Fair enough? You make your case, I respond, you rebutt, I respond, end of debate. Readers can declare their own "winner".

Will gays target children? Apparently you aren't keeping up on current events. Several organizations have made several attempts to inject cirriculum into grade school education both here and elsewhere. Grade school? Really? I don't think heterosexual education is appropriate in grade school. The goal is not to turn them gay (Come on, don't be silly), but to instruct them to discard any training they might receive from home or church and to accept as normal homosexual behavior.

I have not attempted to distinguish between religious and civil marriage. I haven't made it a matter of religion at all. I have repeatedly and continually held that the word has a definition, that the definition has been agreed upon for as long as we can tell in history, and (the courts agree with me here) the definition is being changed to allow same-sex couples to engage in a practice that mimics marriage. The community is not asking for "equal rights". They are demanding an alteration to the existing definition of the term to include them. There is no basis offered for this mandate. And the objection is "to prevent us from changing the definition of marriage to suit us is persecution and hate."

Lies, Dan, all lies. Marriage has been defined the same for all history. Only now has it been altered to suit a particular minority. It does not demean that minority to continue to use the term as it has been used forever. It does not limit their rights. It demands a fundamental change to the language and to society.

And I never even got to "religion" or "morality".

Stan said...

Oh, Jim, Jim, too bad. As much as your position that the fact that marriage produces children as beneficial makes sense, the judge specifically denied that in his ruling. Any disagreement with his view is irrational. Nice try though. I mean, sure, you're right and all, but the courts have ruled against you.

Marshal Art said...

"I think it is okay to mock silly ideas..."

That's funny. When I called Dan's arguments "crap", he had a hissy fit, saying it was "ungracious". This worm turns as it sees that which is necessary to make its case.

"Suggesting that we remove the liberties found in our Constitution just because other nations don't practice those same ideas, surely you could agree that this is a nutty idea, yes?"

"Nutty" is suggesting that such an argument is the core of our opposition. "Nutty" is suggesting that liberties not enumerated have been removed. "Nutty" is suggesting that the state has no interest in traditional marriage, or that the same interest is present in the fraudulent facsimilies.

"Lies, Dan, all lies."

...the basis of every pro-homo argument; their foundation.