One of the big sticking points for people investigating these "wild claims" from the Reformed side that suggest that God chooses some and not others and that God gives faith to some and not others and that regeneration precedes faith -- that sort of thing -- is the issue of the love of God. "Wait a minute!" they will say. "God loves everyone. Your view would diminish the love of God!"
Underlying this position is an apparent premise that for God to love everyone ("the universality of the love of God"), He must do so equally. As was pointed out in a recent conversation, "If a man gave his three children locked boxes, each one containing wonderful gifts, but he only gave one child the key to her particular box, I don't think we would say that he simply loved the other children less." So there is a sense among many (most?) that for God's love to be real, it must be universal and equitable -- applied equally to all. If this is the case, Reformed theology is dead.
The proof of this concept is typically John 3:16. "'God so loved the world,' it says," they will assure me. My attempts to point out that the "so" in that sentence is not a quantitative statement -- "God loved the world so much" -- but a qualitative statement -- "God loved the world in this sense". So I'll leave that alone. And, of course, there is always the idea "God must love everyone equally because He is no respecter of persons!"
What, then, would I offer in the consideration of this claim that God must love everyone and He must do so equally? ("And, please, Stan, be sure it's biblical, not mere opinion.")
Well, first, we have this interesting warning in 1 John: "If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him" (1 John 2:15). Whatever it means, there is some sense in which we are warned not to love the world, so certainly there is equally a sense that God doesn't do the same. Second, we read in Rom 9 "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated." Now, we can get into lengthy discussions about exactly what this means, but for our purposes I don't think we need to go there. I think it is clear, regardless of the nuance, that here is a clear statement (a quote from God) that there are differences in the ways that God loves people. Take, for instance, Pharaoh. We have it on biblical authority that God hardened Pharaoh's heart (e.g., Exo 10:1), and Romans 9 tells us that He did it "that I might show my power in you, and that My name might be proclaimed in all the earth." Whatever you conclude about all that these things entail, I don't think that it's possible to conclude that God treats everyone the same or that He loves everyone in the same way.
Of course, in our own experience we know this to be true. I love my wife and I love pizza, but I certainly don't love them in the same way. Take that idea to the idea of the Church being the Bride of Christ. "Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church." Imagine, then, that it is said of me, "My, how Stan loves his wife! In fact, he loves everyone's wife in the very same way! How marvelous!" And, of course, it would be sick, not marvelous. No, we expect (even require) a husband and wife to love each other in a way that is not equal to the love for family, fellow believers, friends, or food. Each varies. Because I give myself fully to my wife and do not give myself fully to my friends is not an indication that I don't love my friends. (Sorry, I can't even think in terms of "give myself fully to my food".) There are various levels and types of love and one does not negate the other.
So, on the lighter side, our experience tells us that love does not need to be equal to be real. On the heavier side -- the hard biblical facts -- we know that Scripture tells us that God doesn't treat everyone equally, that He actually loves some and "hates" others.
So, in what sense does God "love the world"? The first answer is easy: "Whoever believes in Him has eternal life." That is, 1) not everyone will believe, and 2) God is not obligated in any way to give anyone eternal life, so the fact that He offers it at all is an act of love for all. In fact, the reality that God sent His Son at all is demonstration of His love for all (Rom 5:8). Behind that, the fact that God delays justice in favor of mercy is an incredible act of love. So God certainly loves everyone. But let's be clear here. While I wouldn't suggest that God loves His people more than He loves the world, I think it is abundantly clear that the love for His own is certainly of a different quality than the love for the world. We find this in Jesus's own command to His followers. "By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another" (John 13:35). Just as the Father had a special love for the Son (John 17:23) and just as the Son prayed for His own and not for the rest (John 17:9), we should expect that on one hand God will love the world in its entirety, but on the other hand that the quality (the nature) of that love will vary.
God, like us, is not obligated to love all humans equally. Nor is love diminished simply because it is not equal. We would find it diminished if a wife loved all men in the same manner she loved her husband. In the same way, we shouldn't expect God to love all people in the same way. In that great complaint against this idea -- "God is no respecter of persons!" -- we find this very fact. "Truly I understand that God shows no partiality, but in every nation anyone who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to Him" (Acts 10:34-35). The very sentence proves a difference between those who fear Him and do what is right and those who do not. Love need not be equitable to be real. The Bible tells me so.
4 comments:
The brethren of The Messiah are but "aliens and pilgrims while on the earth" because their "citizenship is in Heaven" and so it is that they have taken heed unto the exhortation too:
“Love Not The World”
”For the WHOLE(not just a portion) world is under the control of the evil one”.......(I John 5:19)
“Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world will pass away, and the lust thereof: but he that does the will of The Only True GOD will abide for ever.”(IJohn2:15-17)
“If you were of the world, the world would love it’s own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hates you. Remember the word that I said unto you, the servant is not greater than his Master. If they have persecuted Me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept My saying, they will keep yours also.” (John15:19-20)
“Where do wars and fighting among you come from? Do they not come of your lusts that war in your members? You lust, and have not: you kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: you fight and war yet you have not, because you ask not. You ask, and receive not, because you ask amiss, that you may consume it upon your lusts. You adulterers and adulteresses, don’t you know that friendship with the world is to be at enmity with The Only True GOD? Therefore whoever will be a friend of the world is the enemy of The Only True GOD.” (James 4:1-4)
“The world cannot hate you; but the world hates Me, because I testify that the works of this world are evil.” (John 7:7)” and “The Messiah gave Himself for our sins, that He might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of The Only True God, Our Father.”(Gal 1:4)
The Messiah testified: “If the world hates you know that it hated Me before it hated you.”(John 5:18) Truly, Truly, I say unto you, except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abides alone: but if it die it brings forth much fruit. He that loves his life in this world shall lose it; and he that hates his life in this world shall have it unto life eternal.” (John 12:24-25)
John testified: “Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hates you.” (I John 3:13) “ James testified, “Whoever would be a friend of this world is the enemy of GOD”(James4:4)
"Come Out of her, MY people"!
Global warming, polluted air, land and waters, toxic wastes, sexual perversion, evil inventions of destruction, greed, hate, carnal warfare, dis-ease(no-peace),,etc,, are all destructive processes that have their root in “the lust of the eye, the lust of the flesh, and the pride of life” all of which fuel the fires of mankind’s “imag”ination ;-(
"Come out from among them and be separate"!
Peace, in spite of the dis-ease(no-peace) that is of this world and it's systems of religion, for "the WHOLE(not just a portion) world is under the control of the evil one" indeed and Truth......
Truth IS, a lie never was and is not.......
Abide in Truth....... francis
So I got to thinking about John 3:16 and how everyone...many people apply "universal" to the love mentioned there. So I looked it up in Strong's. According to the lexicon, this particular iteration of agape (agapesen) means "of persons-to welcome, to entertain, to be fond of, to love dearly. of things-to be well pleased, to be contented at or with a thing." Now, of all those choices of meaning, "to love dearly" is the closest to "universally love", but seems to miss that mark widely. Nothing in the word or text indicates that God must love all people for all time in the same way without variation, but that just can't be applied to the passage in question.
As for "The Love of GOD"?
"He gave HIS Only Begotten Son" The Messiah!
And here is a prime example of the love The Messiah had for the religious ones during the time He walked upon the face of the earth.
Mat 23:13-35 - "But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you shut up The Kingdom of Heaven against men, for you don't go in yourselves, and when others try to enter in, you seek to prevent them.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer, therefore you shall receive the greater damnation.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you compass sea and land to make one convert, and when he is made, you make him twofold more the child of hell that you yourselves are.
Woe unto you, you blind guides, which say, "Whoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing, but whoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!
You blind fools, for what is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifies the gold?
And, whoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whoever swears by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.
You fools and blind, for what is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifies the gift?
Whoever therefore shall swear by the altar, swears by it, and by all things that are on the altar.
And whoever shall swear by the temple, swears by it, and by HIM that dwells in the temple.
And he that shall swear by heaven, swears by The Throne of G-D, and by HIM WHO sits upon The Throne.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith, these you ought to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
You blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
You blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you are liken unto whitewashed tombs, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
Even so you also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within you are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because you build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the tombs of the righteous,
And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
Therefore you are witnesses unto yourselves, that you are the children of them which killed the prophets. You are but filling up the measure of your fathers.
You serpents, youe generation of vipers, how can you escape the damnation of hell?
Therefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them you shall kill and crucify, and some of them you shall scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city.
That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom you slew between the temple and the altar."
YES The Messiah LOVED them, He loved them enough to tell them The Truth even though He knew they wanted to kill Him!
And so it remains unto this day ;-(
The religious ones, and their systems of religion, but carry on the legacy of the pharisee's ;-(
They still seek and desire to crucify The Truth ;-(
Yet, Thankfully Truth Will Always Rise Again!
HalleluYAH!
Father Help! and HE does.......
Peace, in spite of the dis-ease(religion) that is of this wicked, evil world.......
Truth IS, a lie never was and is not.......
Abide in Truth.......
I posted your comments, but I haven't a clue what you're trying to say.
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